Author Topic: 1868 and 1872. Orizava. Sz 1100 and 1100A full scans needed of both.  (Read 2676 times)

Martin "Spuff" Spufford

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Re: 1868 and 1872. Orizava. Sz 1100 and 1100A full scans needed of both.
« Reply #8 on: December 29, 2010, 03:24:01 PM »
I think we can say "case closed" there WAS obviously a complete inner circle it just took a few scans to prove it.
Thanks again.
Up to you Jesper how you handle the insertion in Sz.
spuff
 

Fritz Aebi

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Re: 1868 and 1872. Orizava. Sz 1100 and 1100A full scans needed of both.
« Reply #7 on: December 29, 2010, 02:47:39 PM »
Spuff, Bubba and Meximailers,

Here are two copies with the inner circle clearly visible. Once the upper part, once the lower part. This may proof that there was a complete inner circle, just not always clear as Bubba mentioned.
In a third scan I am showing an unreported variety with the date at top. This has not been shown by Schatzk├ęs, but confirms the one cancellation device theory again and the slugs fitting in all positions - not only the two shown by Schatzk├ęs.
Common cancellations are sometimes very exciting and even with low budget stamps new things can be discovered!

Fritz

Bubba Bland

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Re: 1868 and 1872. Orizava. Sz 1100 and 1100A full scans needed of both.
« Reply #6 on: December 29, 2010, 11:41:27 AM »
I was just making an observation.

Anyway, I think there was an inner circle on the canceler, and as Fritz points out, being seen depended on the wear factor, and likely the pressure. Those without this showing just didn't get this part of the cancel. Schatzkes is therefore misleading.
A collector of Dos Reales of the first design. Always having fun.

Martin "Spuff" Spufford

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Re: 1868 and 1872. Orizava. Sz 1100 and 1100A full scans needed of both.
« Reply #5 on: December 29, 2010, 11:23:26 AM »
I would agree that it is probably a single  canceller with altered slug position but the point of the question was "inner circle" or "no inner cirdcle"?
 
Here is MY best "partial" clearly showing inner circle.
 
Thanks Fritz for all those images. Much appreciated.
 
Still hoping for a strike showing more inner circle than this. Please take a look in your swaps books.
Spuff

Bubba Bland

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Re: 1868 and 1872. Orizava. Sz 1100 and 1100A full scans needed of both.
« Reply #4 on: December 29, 2010, 10:36:49 AM »
It seems to me that this is the same cancel device, and the only difference is when and where the date slugs were placed.
A collector of Dos Reales of the first design. Always having fun.

Fritz Aebi

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Re: 1868 and 1872. Orizava. Sz 1100 and 1100A full scans needed of both.
« Reply #3 on: December 29, 2010, 08:22:42 AM »
Hi Spuff and Meximailers,

Here are the promised scans of 1100A. The same problem without the inner ring, partial inner ring and (almost) complete inner ring. See scans.

Fritz

Fritz Aebi

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Re: 1868 and 1872. Orizava. Sz 1100 and 1100A full scans needed of both.
« Reply #2 on: December 29, 2010, 07:57:23 AM »
Hi Spuff and Meximailers,

The two cancellations are almost impossible to find clear. They can be found without inner ring, partial inner ring or with almost complete inner ring. I could not figure out the reason for that, but eventually it is just a weakness of the inner ring.
Enclosed are two scans of Sz1100 as examples. 1100A will follow in a second message.

Fritz

Martin "Spuff" Spufford

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1868 and 1872. Orizava. Sz 1100 and 1100A full scans needed of both.
« Reply #1 on: December 28, 2010, 05:49:15 PM »
There is some discussion going on regarding the presence of an inner, or part inner circle on either or both of these cancels.
Sz obviously sketched them for his book as the illustrations  are quite crude.
If any one or several people could post scans of FULL cancels of these 2 I would much appreciate it.
300 dpi would be best and the cancel only please. This way the scan can be used as a basis for the Sz update book. :)
spuff